Insertado por VERCINGETORIX en fecha September 19, 19103 at 12:03:43:

En respuesta a: Re: Eta no es el Ira, el Pais Vasco nunca fué un Pais y menos aún vasco, los pobladores de ese territorio donde se instaló esa tribu de salvajes eran los cántabros. insertado por vasco en fecha February 12, 19102 at 19:53:12:

Pero como podeis creer que el vasco tiene alguna relacion con VERCINGETORIX si es una palabra indoeuropea que no guarda la menor relacion con vuestra lengua.
VER-CINGETO-RIX viene de los vocablos celticos “ver”- “cingeto”- “rix”:

- “ver”: de la raiz indoeuropea o "*ver" o “*vre” (español su-per, su-pre-mo, so-ber, so-ber-ano, ingles o-ver etc.) ;

- “cingeto”: de la raiz "Cinn" , "Cing" o "Cyng" (cinta, ceñir) y el sufijo celtico ato, eto: español antiguo cinn-cato, hoy cin-chado, ceñido o cincado, así se denominaba la cinta de distinción ceñida en la frente de los guerreros celtas para mostrar su jerarquía y de ahí la denominación genérica "cingeto" de los guerreros en lengua celta, y nuestras palabras españolas ceñido y cinta; y por fin:

- “rix” que como es obvio es rei o rey en español.

Es decir que VERCINGETORIX : el "supremo - ceñido -rey", o, lo que es lo mismo, el rey ungido supremo, se lee com mucha mas facilidad desde el español que desde cualquier otro idioma europeo, incluidas las lenguas celticas oficialmente consideradas como las mejor conservadas o mas vivas, como el gaelico. Así se comprueba en las dificultades de los estudios británicos al tratar de explicar su etimologia desde el gaelico en la traducion de Gilda. Porque el castellano no es una lengua de raiz latina celtizada, como divulgais los vascos y otros filologos con mas tendencia a copiar lo que otros han dicho antes que a investigar, sino todo lo contrario, el castellano es una lengua de raiz celta latinizada, con independencia de que haya incorporado prestamos de otras lenguas extranjeras como la vasca o berebere o arabe. El hecho de que tenga tantos puntos de union con el latin o con el griego, incluso en el sustrato de los vocablos, nada tiene de extraño dado que estas tres lenguas provienen de la misma familia indoeuropea. Cada tribu celta tenía su rex, y cuando reunian a sus guerreros para presentar batalla al enemigo común, de entre los rex, se elegía el supremo o soberano.

Puedes leer a continuación, si lo deseas, la transcripcion de la etimologia critica de la Gildas' Latin Translation. Veras que la etimologia es aproximadamente la misma, aunque con las dificultades debidas probablemente a que en ingles no conservan o desconocen nuestra vieja palabra celtica “ceñido” que nosotros conservamos en español actual con innumerables derivados como: cincado, cingula (en liturgia), cincho o cincha, cinta, etc., todas referidas a rodear con bandas la frente, cintura etc., y que hoy pervive sobre todo en el lenguaje rustico y las labores de campo y aparejos de ganaderia como suele ocurrir con nuestros mas viejos vocablos.

All of this is speculative, of course, although not wildly so, but whichever way we work out the Brittonic forms once again the two outcomes - dog and butcher - do not appear to be so very far from each other in sonic terms. However if this was all the we had to go on, it must be admitted that our case would remain somewhat strainedand tenuous. But once again, after having worked out the speculative possibilities above, I found another remarkable piece of solid evidence buried in well attested linguistic history. McBain's Etymological Dictionary of Celtic Languages interprets the famous Gaulish and British chieftan name Vercingetorix as follows: ver -cingeto - rix:

The Gaulish word cingeto (this is not really an 'invented' word, it clearly is an element of a well known name) McBain cites as meaning warrior. This word would actually be another acceptable alternative derivation of the common prefix cyn- or cyne- in British and Welsh names. It would also be a possible fit for an early Brittonic form of the Welsh cigydd and the Cornish kiger. The fact that these later forms have come to mean ‘butcher’ rather than ‘warrior’ need be no great difficulty. The same word would happily suffice for both concepts in their respective contexts. The idea of a warrior as a ‘butcher’, and a butcher as a somewhat tamed warrior, is perfectly credible on a cultural and linguistic level.
When we remember that the Latin lanio can also means executioner by extension, once again Gildas’ choice of words appears highly apt, especially as we know that he is not exactly trying to be complementary about this man. In fact he makes it very clear that he regards this warrior prince who calls himself ‘Bear’ as a blood stained destroyer of life and limb. It seems quite credible that the one word-form may have borne a double sense - warrior/butcher - in Gildas’ time, and may even have had a common bloody association way back in its Gaulish roots - the idea of a warrior as one who dismembers bodies with his blade With the later demise of the warrior classes the word simply retained its ‘butchery’ significance and mutated into the modern Welsh and Cornish forms noted above.
Lest this profusion of possibilities is getting confusing it is worth reminding ourselves that *cyn (?dog), *cune (?chief), and *cinge (?warrior and/or ?butcher) are the three late Brittonic/early Welsh forms we are juggling with as candidates for the first element of the name Cynglas. But we could simplify things even further if we suggest that the word cun (?chief) in its older form cuniaid <*cuniato might itself have come from the ancient root word cingeto/warrior, (by the contraction of the ng to n and the loss of the inflected ending). If this is so then the verbal relationship to butcher remains the same as before - chieftan, warrior and butcher all being cognates of the same root in Celtic. However, if this is thought to be stretching linguistics a bit far, then a close pun certainly remains possible between *cuni(ato)/chieftan and *cinge(to)/butcher/warrior, just as it does between *cyno/dog and *cinge/butcher.
It is more obvious with this second element of the name that some sort of word play is in fact going on when Gildas translates Cyne as lanio - butcher, since this is clearly a calculated insult and highly unlikely to be the real meaning of the man's name. If we take the Cyn(g)e- element to mean warrior originally, then it seems that Gildas may only have had to put the less noble sounding spin on the same root to interpret it as butcher and achieve his desired effect. If on the other hand we take the Cyn(e)- element to mean chieftan then a Brittonic pun with the word for butcher is likewise readily available, and may also be from the same root, so the same verbal process may apply. If however we still insist on Cyne - meaning dog, then, as with the colours, the pun is still possible on the basis of the sonic convergence of two Brittonic words - *cyno and *cyn(g)e, - but, as before, this option looks somewhat arbitrary and a more strained in conceptual terms.
The fact that the actual name is written in Gildas text in Latin format as Cuneglase and not Cunoglase is more suggestive of the former being correct than the latter. The final -e is simply the Latin vocative of course, but the middle -e- is not accounted for this way and is probably not an inflection but an integral part of the original word element. All of which lends weight to our preference for Amber Warrior/butcher. The form Cynglas which is found in the regnal lists of later centuries doubtless reflects a contraction of the name, which had remained in use in this early Welsh style, having lost the inflected ending of Brittonic. At the end of the day, whichever sound and meaning we project as the original form (and we will never know for sure), we can see now that either interpretation is completely plausible, and therefore Gildas' Latin translation/pun is not nearly as surprising or unjustified as it first appears.

Como ves VERCINGETORIX o VERCYNGETORIX es un magnifico testimonio de que los vascos no teneis aqui vuestras raices. Pero mejor deberiamos llamaros euskaldunes y no vascos para no caer en la confusion que hoy crea el nombre de vascos con el que llamais a toda la poblacion, porque la poblacion oriunda de lo que ahora llamais pais vasco no es de origen vasco sino celtibero.

En fin, como prueba Vercingetorix es tan evidente que la procedencia de vuestra etnia vasca no se encuentra en nuestras tierras hispanicas de raigambre indoeuropeo celta, que es comprensible que los vascos no os sintais españoles, pero lo que no es comprensible es que despues de tanto tiempo viviendo entre nosotros, aun no hayais aprendido a convivir en paz.

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